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Need some guidance
- Thread starter Ray_k
- Start date
SoI have confirmed my contact details with Cafcass, i’m assuming they will jow be in touch to arrange an a call?
On the other hand, i’ve had a message from my ex through a mutual friend who told me that she is not going to let me see the kids anymore, I pretty much expected that and am prepared for some short term pain with the hope of a better outcome long term. Is there anything I can do in the interim, should I mention that to Cafcass, again it’s probably something i’ll have to raise in a first hearing and ask for contact to be reinstated?
On the other hand, i’ve had a message from my ex through a mutual friend who told me that she is not going to let me see the kids anymore, I pretty much expected that and am prepared for some short term pain with the hope of a better outcome long term. Is there anything I can do in the interim, should I mention that to Cafcass, again it’s probably something i’ll have to raise in a first hearing and ask for contact to be reinstated?
Yes they will contact you either by email or letter with an appointment date and time. Do not miss this telephone appointment. If you miss it, they go ahead and write the report without you, based on what the Mother says. And not possible to rearrange it.
Make a diary note about what the mutual friend said.
Yes you ask for an interim order at first hearing, via a position statement you send at least a week before the first hearing.
If she actually does stop you seeing the kids, then first step is write a polite courteous email, asking her to respect your parental responsibility and saying you will expect to collect the children as usual on x day and x time, and please can she confirm they will be made available. And that you are willing to continue to try and resolve matters in the hope you can reach agreement before the hearing.
It might not do much good but it's evidence of what she does and that you tried to resolve it. Unless you have a solicitor and they can write instead, telling her she must let you see the children.
Make a diary note about what the mutual friend said.
Yes you ask for an interim order at first hearing, via a position statement you send at least a week before the first hearing.
If she actually does stop you seeing the kids, then first step is write a polite courteous email, asking her to respect your parental responsibility and saying you will expect to collect the children as usual on x day and x time, and please can she confirm they will be made available. And that you are willing to continue to try and resolve matters in the hope you can reach agreement before the hearing.
It might not do much good but it's evidence of what she does and that you tried to resolve it. Unless you have a solicitor and they can write instead, telling her she must let you see the children.
thanks, I sent an email to confirm me ssing the kids but she responded by saying that the kids are disturbed following me going to court and that they don’t wish to see me anytime soon until a decision is made by the courts.
I don’t know how long this could end up taking and I am worried with what she’ll be feeding the kids head with during this time along with the pain of not seeing them.
I don’t know how long this could end up taking and I am worried with what she’ll be feeding the kids head with during this time along with the pain of not seeing them.
how old are your kids and why is she discussing court issues with them
10 & 6, she doesn’t really have any valid reason to stop me from seeing them, just wants full control and can’t take the fact it’s gone to court.
I guess it will reflect negatively on her in court for stopping me seeing them completely which is obviously related to going to court.
I guess it will reflect negatively on her in court for stopping me seeing them completely which is obviously related to going to court.
I’ve not yet got a solicitor to send a letter out, I doubt it would make a difference anyway.
In the meantime I have been waiting for cafcass to get in touch as that was the next step. Without any notice I got a call from cafcass earlier whilst I was in a middle of a meeting at work on zoom, luckily I answered the call just in case it was them. I told the lady that I wasn’t informed and she said maybe the email got lost which didn’t fill me with much confidence because I have been checking my emails all the time. Thankfully she has offered to call me back tomorrow so atleast I can prepare for it.
I’ve read through some of the posts, the general consensus for the call I guess is to keep it child focused and to not say anything negative against the ex, I hope it goes well.
In the meantime I have been waiting for cafcass to get in touch as that was the next step. Without any notice I got a call from cafcass earlier whilst I was in a middle of a meeting at work on zoom, luckily I answered the call just in case it was them. I told the lady that I wasn’t informed and she said maybe the email got lost which didn’t fill me with much confidence because I have been checking my emails all the time. Thankfully she has offered to call me back tomorrow so atleast I can prepare for it.
I’ve read through some of the posts, the general consensus for the call I guess is to keep it child focused and to not say anything negative against the ex, I hope it goes well.
That happened to me once. They called me out of the blue while I was at work with no pre arranged appointment time. It didn't go well! At least yours has offered to call you back. But don't be surprised if they don't call back. Let us know how it goes.
I had the call with cafcass this morning, I think it went okay, there was nothing about what the ex had said where I had to respond to so it was just a general chat about the current situation which I think the officer understood, the only thing was I didn’t really get to speak about any specific examples of how i’ve been with the kids and was more of what they like doing. I should get the report next week and the courts will get to see it end of the month and will then decide if it needs to go to a first hearing, Hoping that the report is positive.
I've had a copy of the cafcass report come through and think it's okay.
It states that there are no significant safeguarding concerns but that it is clear that there is conflict between the parents. The ex has claimed that she doesn't want the kids staying with me at my parents and that the kids don't want to spend prolonged period of time with me because they get bored, the officer does state that it could be argued that having to stay in hotels contributes to this as they will be in one room for the duration of the stay, whilst they may go out in the day spending prolonged time in a hotel is not only costly for me but does not provide the children with same freedom and home environment for the children if they were in a house with me.
Ex stated that my parents were abusive to her early in our marriage and that the kids are anxious about visiting my parents as they don't have a relationship with them and for that reason do not wish to see me. The officer commented that stopping of arrangements creates inconsistency for the kids and impacts their relationship with me. It was recommended that the parents should create a positive co parenting relationship and that we should not be projecting our feelings onto the kids, whilst we may have had negative experiences and doesn't mean the kids will share the same experience too.
They advised the court that the matter should be listed for a hearing and that parents should be encouraged to reach their own agreements. If that is not possible then should be listed for a contested hearing with statements filed.
Also that the family would benefit from attending child inclusive mediation before the first hearing to allow the children to voice their wishes for any arrangements going forward.
And that the parents should attend the separated parenting information programme. Cafcass did also say that they would support me in spending time with the kids in the interim.
I feel as if they are kind of siding with me, I don't agree with having child inclusive mediation as the kids will just say what their mum is telling them, also they are 10 and 6 so I didn't think their wishes would be taken into consideration.
Should I attend the separated parenting information programme prior to the first hearing, and for the interim contact I'm assuming I will have to ask for this when I get the date for the first hearing?
Its been over a month since I have seen or spoken to the kids, it's been torture and my mind is in constant overdrive, don't know what they must be thinking and what they are being told. What can I do next, just wait for the hearing date?
It states that there are no significant safeguarding concerns but that it is clear that there is conflict between the parents. The ex has claimed that she doesn't want the kids staying with me at my parents and that the kids don't want to spend prolonged period of time with me because they get bored, the officer does state that it could be argued that having to stay in hotels contributes to this as they will be in one room for the duration of the stay, whilst they may go out in the day spending prolonged time in a hotel is not only costly for me but does not provide the children with same freedom and home environment for the children if they were in a house with me.
Ex stated that my parents were abusive to her early in our marriage and that the kids are anxious about visiting my parents as they don't have a relationship with them and for that reason do not wish to see me. The officer commented that stopping of arrangements creates inconsistency for the kids and impacts their relationship with me. It was recommended that the parents should create a positive co parenting relationship and that we should not be projecting our feelings onto the kids, whilst we may have had negative experiences and doesn't mean the kids will share the same experience too.
They advised the court that the matter should be listed for a hearing and that parents should be encouraged to reach their own agreements. If that is not possible then should be listed for a contested hearing with statements filed.
Also that the family would benefit from attending child inclusive mediation before the first hearing to allow the children to voice their wishes for any arrangements going forward.
And that the parents should attend the separated parenting information programme. Cafcass did also say that they would support me in spending time with the kids in the interim.
I feel as if they are kind of siding with me, I don't agree with having child inclusive mediation as the kids will just say what their mum is telling them, also they are 10 and 6 so I didn't think their wishes would be taken into consideration.
Should I attend the separated parenting information programme prior to the first hearing, and for the interim contact I'm assuming I will have to ask for this when I get the date for the first hearing?
Its been over a month since I have seen or spoken to the kids, it's been torture and my mind is in constant overdrive, don't know what they must be thinking and what they are being told. What can I do next, just wait for the hearing date?
That sounds really positive yes! The conflict between parents comment is risky so you need to be the one to show positive co parenting from now on, even if she doesn't. The way the court looks at it is - if there is conflict between parents, then to avoid the kids being affected by conflict they give the kids to the Mother. And either minimal or indirect only for the Father. The way to avoid this is to be whiter than white. In other words, don't be yourself with your ex. Keep things polite, courteous, civil, especially in writing. Use BIFF texts and emails (brief, informative, friendly, formal - as if writing to a business colleage). Detach from who she is and treat it as a business exercise. Minimise communication with her to just child arrangements - nothing personal, no arguments. Don't react to any nasty stuff she says or sends. Cool off then do a Biff text or email (or ignore if there's nothing requires a response).
So that is ongoing. It also builds up evidence as you go along. You won't believe how helpful these texts and emails can be later to promote your side of things.
As for the other things you mentioned. I agree 100% that child inclusive mediation is a bad idea. A mediator tried to persuade me into that once and I was horrified having just told her my ex was heavily alienating my son right now! Clearly she didn't know what PA was. She just kept saying - but the child might say something to me they wouldn't say to the parents. I said no the child will be under massive pressure and will say what his Mother tells him to say because he's terrified of what will happen to him if he doesn't. It was like talking to a brick wall.
Sorry - ranting on a bit there. You don't have to do it. They are suggesting mediation before first hearing (unusual). Of course it might mean your ex is quite keen on the idea of the kids being involved! But it may look good for you if you start mediation with your ex. You don't have to agree to the kids being included and can tell the mediator you don't agree. As I say, it's unusual as you'll have already had a MIAM and presumably mediation didn't work/happen before you applied to court (can't remember without reading back).
It's not compulsory though. I think they're basically saying - there are no welfare issues, try and sort it out before first hearing. No welfare issues is good. Conflict between parents is not good. It's a bit unfair because they're basically putting the onus on "the parents" to sort it out when you can;t make her behave differently. That is common. The most important thing from now on though is, never say anything negative about the ex and show you are attempting amicable co parenting (even if it's not going to have any effect on her). Sometimes you have to grit your teeth and send a really nice message! That sometimes worked for me - a bit of courtesy and flattery made my ex agree to the odd thing. In the early days. Not these days!
SPIP course. Yes you can do it yourself before first hearing. You'll have to pay for it, but it will give you some brownie points for doing it voluntarily. If the court order it, it's free. But doing it yourself first shows you are being proactive about sorting things out. Good idea. I don't think it's that expensive. It's quite good too.
Even better would be to send a brief text to your ex politely saying - you think it would help the children if both of you went on this SPIP course before the first hearing, which might help resolve some things, and then had mediation to discuss things afterwards. You are keen to resolve things between you. What does she think?
And see what kind of response you get. She may be equally polite if she is trying to get things to go her way as well or she may send you a rude response. Both messages would be good evidence later.
So that is ongoing. It also builds up evidence as you go along. You won't believe how helpful these texts and emails can be later to promote your side of things.
As for the other things you mentioned. I agree 100% that child inclusive mediation is a bad idea. A mediator tried to persuade me into that once and I was horrified having just told her my ex was heavily alienating my son right now! Clearly she didn't know what PA was. She just kept saying - but the child might say something to me they wouldn't say to the parents. I said no the child will be under massive pressure and will say what his Mother tells him to say because he's terrified of what will happen to him if he doesn't. It was like talking to a brick wall.
Sorry - ranting on a bit there. You don't have to do it. They are suggesting mediation before first hearing (unusual). Of course it might mean your ex is quite keen on the idea of the kids being involved! But it may look good for you if you start mediation with your ex. You don't have to agree to the kids being included and can tell the mediator you don't agree. As I say, it's unusual as you'll have already had a MIAM and presumably mediation didn't work/happen before you applied to court (can't remember without reading back).
It's not compulsory though. I think they're basically saying - there are no welfare issues, try and sort it out before first hearing. No welfare issues is good. Conflict between parents is not good. It's a bit unfair because they're basically putting the onus on "the parents" to sort it out when you can;t make her behave differently. That is common. The most important thing from now on though is, never say anything negative about the ex and show you are attempting amicable co parenting (even if it's not going to have any effect on her). Sometimes you have to grit your teeth and send a really nice message! That sometimes worked for me - a bit of courtesy and flattery made my ex agree to the odd thing. In the early days. Not these days!
SPIP course. Yes you can do it yourself before first hearing. You'll have to pay for it, but it will give you some brownie points for doing it voluntarily. If the court order it, it's free. But doing it yourself first shows you are being proactive about sorting things out. Good idea. I don't think it's that expensive. It's quite good too.
Even better would be to send a brief text to your ex politely saying - you think it would help the children if both of you went on this SPIP course before the first hearing, which might help resolve some things, and then had mediation to discuss things afterwards. You are keen to resolve things between you. What does she think?
And see what kind of response you get. She may be equally polite if she is trying to get things to go her way as well or she may send you a rude response. Both messages would be good evidence later.
So many similarities with my case it's almost like we are living parallel lives. I haven't seen my son since 5th March. I too was/am being controlled and having everything dictated too me like I had no say or rights. I had the emotional blackmail and the threats. Plus false allegations! And it is daunting facing the prospect of taking it all to court. And you do run the risk of escalating conflict and increasing the risk of denial of access by doing so if it hasn't already happened but It is better to brace yourself for that storm and buckle up for the ride as you should come out the other side with your rights firmly pinned down and hopefully you can't ever have your position as a father controlled ever again.
Your case seems to have expedited much quicker than mine. My fingers and toes are crossed for you and I will be watching intently for the outcome.
Your case seems to have expedited much quicker than mine. My fingers and toes are crossed for you and I will be watching intently for the outcome.
Thanks Ash that’s reassuribg, i’m thinking of contacting her to ask about the kids and see if she wants to look at resolving things even though she has said I can’t see the kids until the court process is over, also she will think that i’m only asking to make myself look good and will drag this out as long as she can without me seeing the kids.
Kyle, i’ve been following your story too and was thinking the exact same thing, our ex’s would definetly get on with each other! Hoping you get what you deserve, I feel and share your pain, not many people understand what we go through except those that actually experience it.
Kyle, i’ve been following your story too and was thinking the exact same thing, our ex’s would definetly get on with each other! Hoping you get what you deserve, I feel and share your pain, not many people understand what we go through except those that actually experience it.
Even if you do manage to resolve things, don't withdraw the court application. An agreement is worth nothing and can change in an instant! So if you did manage to agree, whether by discussion or mediation or whatever, then you'd need to carefully say that you would like a consent order and that can be achieved at the first hearing without matters going any further. It can all be drawn up in advance and the hearing just be a formality. Thing is most exes don't want to commit to a consent order. Or commit to anything official! So then you're back to letting the court process go ahead. Main thing is keep things polite and courteous on your side (even if you have to act to do it!) during this situation - to protect yourself and to show the conflict is only one sided.
I think trying to reach agreement isn't the main goal here (and from what you've said I doubt it will happen!) - the main goal is to try and get things reasonably amicable communication wise. Again that's to protect yourself, but it's also to make your kids lives better - less stress for them feeling in the middle - they are juggling all this and trying to please both parents. It's actually a lot easier to be courteous and amicable once you've got a court order!
I think trying to reach agreement isn't the main goal here (and from what you've said I doubt it will happen!) - the main goal is to try and get things reasonably amicable communication wise. Again that's to protect yourself, but it's also to make your kids lives better - less stress for them feeling in the middle - they are juggling all this and trying to please both parents. It's actually a lot easier to be courteous and amicable once you've got a court order!
I messaged the ex and she was not very receptive, she has stated that the children do not want to spend time with me over a prolonged period or stay with me at their grandparents, also as a result of going to court they don’t wish to see me right now. The kids have never said anything of the sort to me and it is what she wants not the kids, i’m worried because the kids are scared of her and do and say what she wants.
She has said I should not be forcing myself against their wishes. I offered her mediation again and she has said she can’t afford it, which would be pointless anyway as she would never agree.
She has said that If I stop the court case then she will speak to the kids who may then wish to see me and that we go back to what the arrangements were before.
Feels like she’s using the kids against me and filling their heads with all sorts, and the longer it goes without me seeing them the more under her influence they will get.
I think the only choice I really have is to wait for the first hearing and until then continue to suffer. Can’t get my head round as to how someone could be so heartless just because they don’t want their power over the children to be compromised. I have not messaged her back but want to put her straight, or is it best to just leave it and not get drawn into an argument considering cafcass have stated their being conflict between the parents?
She has said I should not be forcing myself against their wishes. I offered her mediation again and she has said she can’t afford it, which would be pointless anyway as she would never agree.
She has said that If I stop the court case then she will speak to the kids who may then wish to see me and that we go back to what the arrangements were before.
Feels like she’s using the kids against me and filling their heads with all sorts, and the longer it goes without me seeing them the more under her influence they will get.
I think the only choice I really have is to wait for the first hearing and until then continue to suffer. Can’t get my head round as to how someone could be so heartless just because they don’t want their power over the children to be compromised. I have not messaged her back but want to put her straight, or is it best to just leave it and not get drawn into an argument considering cafcass have stated their being conflict between the parents?
Just to add. My ex does this all the time ( even though we have acourt order).
The kids want this / have asked that. Always blames the poor middle man/woman.
Yet when the kids are with me apart from the odd bit of behaviour (which you just get with kids) it's all fine
The kids want this / have asked that. Always blames the poor middle man/woman.
Yet when the kids are with me apart from the odd bit of behaviour (which you just get with kids) it's all fine